Are You Ready to Defend Without Firearms?

Author: ZAC Admin
Submitted: 11 Oct 2008
Filed under: General &Home Defense &Mobile Defense &Weapons

105 Responses to “Are You Ready to Defend Without Firearms?”

1. Goldfish on 12 Oct 2008 at 1:34 am #

   Now, I’ve touted the use of weapon one for a good long while, and I’m glad to see a topic like this up. I myself am not a gun owner (sadly, but guns are expensive and I like to have food and a roof), so I tend to look at any zombie situation as “use what you have until you can find a gun”. Luckily for me, my home is a regular treasure trove of potential weapons, some single use and some able to be used for an extended period of time. As I write this I’m looking about my bedroom and noticing plenty of usable things, so I suppose I should share them…

   First of all, if you’re like me you have a power strip in your home somewhere, and these can be quite useful as a flail. The ones with built in surge protectors can be kind of heavy and the cord is long enough in most cases that you can get a good swing going and do some severe damage to a Zed’s noodle, or use it to crash open a window and bug out.

   Another thing most people would probably ignore are dresser drawers. I have a hardwood dresser that stands about five feet tall. Tearing the facing off one of the drawers creates a hefty wooden club that can be used easily with two hands. Mine has metal handles that could cause even more damage if placed just right. A little barbaric, yes, bu there’s something satisfying about bashing ol’ Zack’s brains in with a blunt wooden object.

   The hanger rod from your closet or (if sturdy enough) shower rod from your bathroom. A long, in most cases heavy metal pipe that can simultaneously be used as a bludgeoning weapon or something to keep the dead much longer than arms distance from you. With a good tug the drywall will break rather easily and voila! Instant murder tool.

   Look right beneath you: that’s right, the very chair that has been so good to you on your internet travels. Most office chairs are sturdy, heavy, and can at least be thrown to make a window exit or slow down pursuers. If it’s on wheels and you’ve taken the above clothes rod down, you can relive your favorite Spartan war film! Push the chair into them, bash over skull with rod, move forward. Lather, rinse, repeat, escape.

   Floor lamps pose much the same advantage as your household rods, and are alot easier to get detached from the wall. Another advantage to them is, as long as they are plugged in and the bulb is exposed, you may be able to produce an electric shock to your would be assailant…theoretically…>.>

   Play guitar? El Kabong. If you have an electric, you’ll get a couple more hits and a long sturdier of a body to use, but an acoustic will at least slow them down and give you a nice, sturdy guitar neck to bash things with.

   And, my absolute favorite: The deadbolt on your front/back door. Lock up the front, make alot of noise and hope they follow you that direction, use the peep hole to check, them clamber out a window and head for the hills.

   In a situation like this, you need to remember a few things: distance, mobility, and exit strategy. You don’t want to wind up within arms reach of your assailant because, frankly, that’s more dangerous than necessary and you’ll be in tight quarters likely inside of a home. You have to be able to get the hell out of dodge, and you have to know when to leave stuff and when to take stuff. You won’t make it far out a small window with a standing floor lamp, but the towel shelves from your linen closet could prove useful in the future. Finally: you are not the Kool-Aid man, you will not burst through your living room wall and shout “Oh Yeah!”. Know which places are secure enough to escape, know which doors/windows lead to the safest place, and have a plan of escape from every point of egress. Stay alert, stay alive, stay mobile!

   For all his bluster, it is the sad province of Man that he cannot choose his triumph. He can only choose how he will stand when the call of destiny comes.
   -Mohinder Suresh

2. HeavenlySword on 12 Oct 2008 at 6:43 pm #

   Without a firearm, I am limited to engaging only a few undead at a time, and am extremely vunerable to being swarmed.

   In small teams or by myself, I can retain enough stealth that my katana keeps me alive, but its living on the edge.

   Against other people, who possibly have weaponry, my katana is useful only for ninja-tactics, and thus insufficient

   With a firearm, my chances for survival are radically higher, especially versus hostile humans

3. Goldfish on 12 Oct 2008 at 7:41 pm #

   Well HeavenlySword, with an attitude like that you’re cattle. Weapons are all around you if you can just see them not as household objects but weapons. Anything from a fire extinguisher to (maybe, no guarantees on a successful attempt) a portable defribbilator (sp?). You just have to think laterally, which a great many people posting on here have trouble doing. In the event of a zombie outbreak we are not all going to have weapons on hand, especially not firearms. I don’t care how ghetto, or hard, or military trained, or psychotic you are, you won’t have a gun everywhere. If you have your Katana with you, there’s nothing to be afraid of, anyway. Let’s do an exercise: look around you right now. This very second. Post everything you see that could be used as a weapon. Trust me, you’ll be surprised!

   For all his bluster, it is the sad province of Man that he cannot choose his triumph. He can only choose how he will stand when the call of destiny comes.
   -Mohinder Suresh

4. BeefingJection on 12 Oct 2008 at 9:23 pm #

   Goldfish, I disagree with you about the use of a guitar as a weapon. Now, obviously the choice between smashing a guitar and lurching is no choice at all. But a guitar–particularly an acoustic–is a much more effective weapon against cabin fever than against zombies. In any long-term survival situation, you’re going to wish you had kept that guitar when the stress levels start rising. The undead are a constant threat, but your fellow survivors know where you sleep…..

5. Die_Angel on 13 Oct 2008 at 4:05 am #

   Being European i know very well that in the case of a zombie outbreak there is no chance i will ever get my hands on a gun, armouries here only carry a tiny amount of 9mm guns and hunting weapons.

   Assaulting a police station to get guns here would probably not work that well, so any gun we could get our hands on would be out of good luck.
   However there is plenty of things that can be used as an okay weapon:
   -Any tube-ish object can be turned in an okay spear with a bit of time.
   -Peoples still have plenty of knives of all kind and those make rather efficient makeshift spearheads.
   -Gardening equipments, like shovels, and pickaxes might be a little heavy but it’s better than nothing.
   -Any piece of wood can become a really dangerous morgenstern once covered with long and thick nails with their heads cut at an angle.
   -There is plenty of medieval weapon designs that, can be crudely reproduced and well, our ancesters used these things because they where working!

   Makeshift polearms is the first thing that comes to my mind personally because they are pretty much made by design to keep your target far from you, but those wouldn’t work properly inside buildings, for scavenging in relative safety i would suggest 2 or 3 scavengers using home made shields (anything light, rigid and covering will do, large plastic trashcan, big piece of wood…), so they can prevent the undeads to swarm on the scavenging team and push them back without risking their life, while the rest of the team can take position to deal with the threat.

6. sean on 13 Oct 2008 at 5:17 pm #

   there are several good non ballistic weapons that you can easily obtain and use,axe,machete,baseball bat,shovel,knives and pretty much anything that can either 1.remove a head or 2.destroy a brain
   there are often classes you can take, on improvised weapon combat,using table legs,piping…etc
   it’s just a matter of using your brain and destroying a zed’s

7. die_angel on 13 Oct 2008 at 7:05 pm #

   To destroy a zombie i don’t think blunt weapons are that good, they work well for humans because we are very sensitive to pain, broken bones and contusions work well on humans but on zombies?
   If i have to defend with a blunt weapon i would want, as soon as poosible to add perforating elements to it, namely nails. this will concentrate the power of the impact on very small surfaces, increasing the chances to inflict deep dammages.
   Another advantage is that it isn’t that easy to just chop off someone’s head. Much easier during panic to bash it senseless with a stick covered with spikes.

8. 3ID on 13 Oct 2008 at 7:52 pm #

   Die_angel this post would be concentrated you and our other European allies since it is hard for you to get firearms for me it would all most be unmanageable to go any were with out my SIG .45 i also carry a pocket knife witch is under 3″ so that would do little good to a zed at home my room contains a small arsenal AR AK shotguns and a sniper rifle and plenty of ammo for all for my no firing weapons i carry a 7″ blade and a tomahawk also i have walking sticks that could be fashioned in to spears but at the first hint of an out break i will grab by bug out bag and head to my friends witch has a more impressive arsenal then i do

9. Dreamornaut on 13 Oct 2008 at 8:53 pm #

   Well if you’re talking about having to improvise weapons to use against the zed, I think your best bet would be something you could use to knock them over, or push them away if you have to. Most of the stuff around you that could be used to actually crack open or puncture a skull will most likely be either heavy or could break rather easily. The force needed to cave in a zombies skull for instance will likely break your baseball bat whether it’s wood or aluminum. Most kitchen knives will snap, or if attached to a pole of some sort may come lose. A tire iron will leave you slightly unbalanced for a moment after your swing and even then will possibly require a second blow.

   Because of this I think it’s ultimately important to remember that your goal isn’t to so much kill the zombie as much as get it out of your way so you can escape, which should be the only reason you’re taking one on in this situation. I would rather have a pole or something else I could use to push the zombies out of the way or pin them with. God forbid if one gets past my efforts to heard them I’m is serious trouble and a good sized Phillips head screw driver could be my last ditch effort at survival. Ultimately the most important thing at this point is knowing your escape options and if you’re in a unfamiliar area, keeping your head so that you can find an escape route without panicking and getting yourself cornered.

10. Suki on 13 Oct 2008 at 9:45 pm #

    I’ve always been a big supporter of resourcefulness. If in my home, I know of 2 long, strong metal pipes, one on either side of the house. Perfect for someone with my limited arm-strength to handle.

    Even at work, we’ve got counters to hide behind, trays to bludgeon with, and a big, sturdy metal pizza spatula that can work like an axe if necessary.

    An both places have numerous exits. Work, of course, has lots of obstacles that will be a slight hindrance to a human, but a big blockage to zombies.

11. beans on 14 Oct 2008 at 6:47 am #

    In the event of a zombie outbreak we are not all going to have weapons on hand, especially not firearms. I don’t care how ghetto, or hard, or military trained, or psychotic you are, you won’t have a gun everywhere.
    Goldfish

    he has a point but i Believe that most places will have weapons readily avalable just think about it. so what if they break after a few uses they still offer you the time to escape and if nothing else find another better weapon to give yourself longer to get to said firearm or saftey zone.

12. Sinisterminister on 14 Oct 2008 at 9:25 am #

    In choosing a weapon, or creating a barricade, remember the basic concept of “simple tools.” There are a handful of “simple machines” that can be found just about anywhere, and used in in a nearly endless series of ways. Consider:
    The hammer: This one is the most popular, the easiest to use, and is the most discussed on this page. Anything you can get a good swing with is considered a “hammer.” The best hammers are those which most smoothly become an extension of your arm, and are the most dense at the head, or striking surface. The “hammer” increases your striking force- and your reach.
    The wedge: when barricading a door, never forget the simple device known as a “wedge.” A little wooden doorstop can greatly increase the amount of force required to open a door. In fact, there are times when a little piece of wood or metal, with a point on one end and a wider opposite end can become a better barrier than objects twenty times its size.
    The lever: “Give me a lever large enough, and I can move the world.” – Archemidies. Any stick that is long enough and strong enough to take the strain is a lever. used properly (say, in conjunction with a wedge) greatly increases one’s lifting capacity. Would you like to fling an old AC unit off a roof onto the undead horde surrounding your building? There’s no need to strain your back! Use that board or snapped off flag pole to finish the job.
    The Pulley: Redistributes weight, increases lifting capacity, and pulling strength. Why carry all those survival supplies to the top of the stairwell, when rope, a wheel rim, and a dowel rod can give you instant lifitng power? When time is of the essence, use your head.
    The wheel: Duh. Two wheels are good for escape, one wheel (Wheelbarrow) for hauling, and (the correct) four wheels can carry your fight back to the undead!
    This whole discussion centers on the proper use of simple machines. Let’s get creative!

13. ZombieCombatClub on 14 Oct 2008 at 9:59 am #

    Very appropriate topic, as the Zombie Combat Club was created to specifically address hand-to-hand combat with the living dead, precisely when you do not have access to a firearm, or your ammunition runs out.

    All the points you make are valid, and much more detail needs to be addressed with this subject.

14. Fullcircle on 14 Oct 2008 at 4:29 pm #

    Improvisation is definitely the way to go if you can’t get your hands on a gun. Just about anything can be used as a weapon- not nessacarily to kill a zombie, but to incapacitate it temporarily so that you can either finish it off easily, get a more lethal weapon or escape.
    For instance (and the Hitchiker’s Guide to the Galaxy fan in me requires that I mention this) a towel (or other suitable large bit of cloth) can be quite an effective weapon for making an escape. Wrap it tightly around you hand a few times and you have an improvised boxing glove, allowing you to punch the zeds with a lessened (although not removed) risk of getting that fist bitten. Or, toss it over the zombie’s face to buy a bit of time to grab a more useful weapon. Alternatively, once the towel is over it’s head, jerk it to the ground (using the corners of the towel) and finish it with a nice curbstomp.

    Now, obviously, you aren’t going to use a towel in any sort of planned assault or for more than one or two zombies, but in a desperate situation this sort of creativity might save your (or someone else’s) life.

15. Gurilla on 15 Oct 2008 at 2:00 am #

    As far as firearms are concerned it is in my opinion the duty of all responsible adults to have at least one firearm in the home for your standard home defense. I myself have a pistol arms length away right now and a rifle and shotgun only a few yards away, this does give me peace of mind knowing that I am relatively safe from both people that wish me ill and a fair number of zombies but on the other side of that I also keep a machete just as close to me I thing it pays to be prepared.

16. Bhargest on 15 Oct 2008 at 10:29 am #

    Die_Angel? Do you live in an alternate Europe? *g*

    Take a look at Switzerland. Soldiers, even those not on active duty, are supposed to take their ASSAULT RIFLES back home. Going eastwards, and considering some “half-black-markets”, there are more Guns on European Ground than most people would admit…

    “Armouries here only carry a tiny amount of 9mm guns and hunting weapons.” Right. But a good sturdy hunting rifle might proove right to discuss with scavengers, if not against Zed’s.

    Goldfish? Don’t try the way of a defibrillator. a) it’s is far to heavy, b) it is not very handy, c) you have to do it by “lay on hands” while Mr. Z is grabbing, and finalley d) why stop a non-beating heart?! *g*

    My two cent, as many others above, is having a sharp mind is the best weapon the have. Surely, blade weapons (from knives to medievals to asian-style) are coool, but hey, most of these are made for laying around in showcases or living-rooms. Try to get some hardened weapons, or you might get disarmed by a sharp breaking noise. And, do some training.

    Always remember, it doesn’t matter if you kill a hundred Zed’s by gun, 83 by blade, and bring down another 4 dozen by a bludgeoning device – it’s not like a vid-game where you can restart after getting 9.371 Points for Creative-Z-Killing

17. ZAC Admin on 15 Oct 2008 at 11:56 am #

    “As far as firearms are concerned it is in my opinion the duty of all responsible adults to have at least one firearm in the home for your standard home defense. I myself have a pistol arms length away right now and a rifle and shotgun only a few yards away, this does give me peace of mind knowing that I am relatively safe from both people that wish me ill and a fair number of zombies but on the other side of that I also keep a machete just as close to me I thing it pays to be prepared.”

    You missed the spirit of the article. Are you ready to defend yourself without access to any of these weapons?

    You could very well have a gun in your home or car, but I would venture to say that there are many people who do not. YOu could easily find yourself in an outbreak situation and not have immediate access to your firearm of choice. Most people do not go to a shopping mall strapped with a handgun or machete. If you walk in to rent a movie with a shotgun and machete, then I guess you will always be prepared. However, for those that do not actively carry a firearm, or for those who will end up defending themselves without reasonable access to a firearm, this article was meant to get you thinking in that regard.

18. Dreamornaut on 16 Oct 2008 at 2:10 am #

    I would include that regardless of what weapon you choose, whether it’s a firearm, sword, or the lamp stand in the living room I think it’s important that you have a good idea what exactly that weapon is capable of doing. Even if you’re out in public or at a friends house and you are forced to grab something on the fly you should at least have a good working idea of what it’ll accomplish when you wield it against the zombie hordes.

    After all, if you’re at a friends house and a zombie crashes through a window and you reach for a near bye fire place poker and when you try to shove it into the corpses brain box, it would sure suck if it had a hollow aluminum shaft that just scraps the flesh of it’s face and bends causing you to fall into the waiting arms of dead Fred. The greatest weapon and advantage the human race has is it’s head, so regardless of where you are when the dead rise if you keep your head you are better armed then them.

19. Mathuselah on 16 Oct 2008 at 9:38 pm #

    Kudos to die_angel for the shield idea. That’s exactly the kind of mental ZAC scenario improvisation that I come here to see. A lesson I’ll remember…just in case. I wager that it’d be useful even in the 28 days/weeks later (running zombies) scenario.

    That being said, this article speaks to a truth I’ve known for quite some time. It never hurts to keep around a few blunt weapons around. In any unexpected scenario. Ive had a crowbar under my car seat for the last ten years…just in case. I have an old-school Irish sheleileh (iron/rock mace) that used to be a fence post stashed inconspicuously in my living room, and knives throughout. Found weapons are great, but its better to be looking all the time, not just in the heated temper of a zombies evasion. And remember some good macguyver tricks like building a body-sized shield and possibly practicing the Greek turtle formation with some good friends.

    Boy Scout motto: be prepared

20. Goldfish on 18 Oct 2008 at 2:05 pm #

    I see beef’s point but would like to reiterate the fact that, in a pinch, a guitar will do. And as for Sinister, I love your comment on simple machines. LOVE IT. I was trying to go the “KISS” method as much as possible in my initial post and completely spaced on simple machines. As for the Defibrillator well….yeah I was taking a shot in the dark on that one. Though it stands to reason that since the zombie is still moving there is some sort of nervous system working, and electrocution might at least cripple the beast long enough to give you time to high tail it outta there. It may not kill it, but it will at least shut it down I would think…may have to do some research on that one.

    Another thing I’d like to bring up are people’s use of knives and screwdrivers. Yeah, they work well in theory, and you may even have one strong enough to puncture the skull. What I’d like to remind you all of, however, are the dozens of cases all over the world of people having everything from rebar to knives to nails to even screwdrivers jammed in their heads without so much as causing real brain damage. These cases are few, but still something of concern. There are portions of the brain, especially within the Zed brain, that may not have any function to keep one alive. You would have to hit just right with these thin puncturing objects, or stab through the skull and swirl it around a bit. This is why I lean towards blunt objects, because something as small as a brick can very easily cause enough damage to the brain to cause a vital shutdown. The key here is not the caving in of the skull or physical destruction of the brain as much as it is the shockwave from the blow. This shockwave, when striking the head, causes the brain to move (and bleed/bruise, causing concussions in the living), and in cases of a hard enough strike move enough to cause brain damage or death. The same theory applies to the Zed, which anatomically is exactly like us. You don’t want to be that one person who drives a screwdriver four inches into a zombie’s skull, then the ol’ stench reach up and start chewing you to death. As for broken bones, they will still have a similar effect on a zed that they would on a human. A zombie can’t walk with broken legs, will have trouble expelling air to moan with broken ribs, and can’t reach you with broken hands or arms. Again, the blunt object is king here. Yes, with a knife or other sharp object you can tear ligaments and muscles, leaving the limbs useless, but with a blunt object it’s a tad easier to just crack one of your zeds and slow them down or even disable them completely.

    For all his bluster, it is the sad province of Man that he cannot choose his triumph. He can only choose how he will stand when the call of destiny comes.
    -Mohinder Suresh

21. MSB on 19 Oct 2008 at 12:57 am #

    Of course I am. I’ll just use Firelegs. =)

22. Dr Who on 19 Oct 2008 at 1:18 am #

    The ultimate in impromptu weapons has to fall to the simple staff. Available in broom/mop handles, poles, and many other things they can be found EVERYWHERE. It takes really no training to use one semi effectively and with training they become a truly awesome weapon. In the initial stages of a breakout your primary goal in to just get the heck out of dodge. While a broom handle is woefully inadaquete to dispatch zeds you can easily use it to sweep (pun intended) them off their feet. Since your normal corpse is quite undextrous you have adequite escape time. Let someone else try to kill the damn thing, you taking out one zombie won’t make a lick of difference to the thousands of other ones and just gives the rest of them time to catch up to you while you’re busy. In the intial outbreak 99.9% of us won’t have time to make weapons or find decent weapons. Once you are out of the urban/sub-urban area where you will be easy pickings for the dead, THEN you can look/make your real dispatchiing device. Other things to consider are firextingishers to temporarily blind and disorient and shovels as short polearms. Another weapon you can use as long as the water is still on (it’ll stay on for awhile after the outbreak) is a firehose. While it really a fixxed position weapon and not that effective in actually damaging them, it really rocks in being able to clear your path and get them out of the way for your escape.

23. Instruisto on 19 Oct 2008 at 10:05 am #

    I’d have to say this article is a step in the right direction for this site. Far more practical than usual (at least for the initial encounter with the undead). Bless your makeshift weapons with holy water or holy oil and they will be at least 5% more effective.

24. Dr Who on 20 Oct 2008 at 1:01 pm #

    One thing you must think about is that most swords found on the market today aren’t intended for any use other than display. Most of these have no tang (the part of the blade that goes into the handle). Even half tang isn’t effective if you are trying to open skulls. Take your pretty katana apart and look at what it there. Most of you will find a threaded rod welded to the blade. This will bend at best or snap off at worst, leaving you with a worthless piece of junk in your hands. Also the steel used isn’t going to stand up to constant use. Do yourself a favor, stick to blunt weapons or axes. If you can find a real double ended woodmans axe (really a type of battle axe) you have the ultimate in antizombie weapons. While not as effective against people, the little finesse and raw power of the axe comes into play well against the dead.

25. Necrowerx on 20 Oct 2008 at 7:01 pm #

    Heh, I like the firehose idea Dr. Who. I mean, that situation isn’t likely to come up much, but that’d be funny to see… and quite effective too, I think.

    They might have had a good idea in “Dead Alive”, some kind of makeshift lawnmower shoulder mounted as a shield w/ spinning blades, if you had NO other choice but to ram through a dozen Zeds at some point. Definitely not a primary weapon though!

    Goldfish is right though, it’s not about killing them, but about disabling them or slowing them down enough to escape, and taking out their legs and/or arms will go a long way toward saving your life.

    I have to say though, I’m still a fan of machetes and kukris, too.

26. FallenKnight on 20 Oct 2008 at 7:02 pm #

    Goldfish, Dr. Who, it sounds like you guys have really given a lot of thought about improvised weapons & how to utilize them to your advantage. I especially like the fact that you made a case for not rushing “headlong into the fray” but devising a workable escape plan.
    Personally, I regularly carry a gun, but not at work. I would like to reinforce the idea that an IW does not necessarily have to break through a skull (which is amazingly hard & durable) but should be used to immobilize a Zed.
    Ideally, the place to go after on a Zed would be the knee joint. They are pretty sturdy when used as designed, but it doesn’t take much force to ruin one. You also can generate a lot more power swinging downward across your body. So anything can be used effectively that way.

    Another point no one has brought up yet is time. You only need to use an IW to buy yourself some time. If you have a safehouse & enough provisions for about a week or two, there will be enough firearms just laying around to make the whole thing worthwhile.

27. Dr Who on 20 Oct 2008 at 8:23 pm #

    Fallen, look at my posts under the “avoiding public facilities” topic for my thought on the fires that will turn cities into candles. Safehouses aren’t the way to go. GET OUT OF THE CITIES AND SUBURBS!!! They will burn.

28. Dr Who on 21 Oct 2008 at 8:47 am #

    The problems with formations like these is the training that is required. You would have to have a core of indivduals dedicated to constant training. Awesome against massed zeds these formations are useless if one individual freaks and runs. The phalanx quickly disintegrates into single soldiers outnumbered in the middle of a mass of zombies. But if you had a large settlement 150+ people you could have dedicated soldiers. With sniper support a phalanx would be just awesome for cleaning out cities. Wonderful idea with the right support behind it. Wow!

29. 3ID on 21 Oct 2008 at 6:07 pm #

    for clearing city’s i will stick to my strykers with the 50 cal mounted and the RPG cage and some good sharp shooters on the rear

    you can bring a couple ones in with different mounts they have a wide range, from 105 cannons to 25 mike mikes and MK 19 also a great stand off weapon is your 120mm mortars i should know that what i do 72m F*** you up radius an they are quite simple to operate

    i know its not an IW but if you talking about clearing a city with a F****ing Phalanx or any other formation your an idiot i would roll at least 12 vehicles deep 5 Strykers with four dismount personal in each three M985 HEMMTs for supplies and ammo and two M1151 up armored as recon and gun trucks and two M978 Fuel trucks 5000 gallons a piece thats what i would have if i rolled in to a city not some gay litter roman formation

30. Fullcircle on 21 Oct 2008 at 8:07 pm #

    The whole point of this discussion is survival without firearms, genius.
    and I somehow doubt you have access to strykers.

31. Dr Who on 21 Oct 2008 at 9:31 pm #

    If 3ID is telling the truth (and it sounds like he knows his stuff) he has access to LAVs and APCs, though from the way he talks I would say lower end sgt. rank? But for the rest of us schlubs who aren’t in any longer we aren’t likely to get near that kind of equipment. Looted vehicles from NG and reserve units, but those won’t have weapons (those are kept in bank type vaults inside the armoury). And like Full said it’s a discussion without weapons. Though .50 cals, 25mm guns, 120mm mortars, and 105mm cannons are a bit overkill unless you mob shooting or just going for collateral damage. But I was talking about clearing the cities, not wiping them from the map. And if you are not wiping them, guess what, you still sent in troops. That’s why we still have Infantry Divisions, you should know that. And this foe doesn’t use weapons so tight formations are an advantage. I will say that 40mm grenades would be awesome to clear crowds. I myself would hope, not expect though, the military to be there to do the clearing. I think and plan for the worst though.

32. Dr Who on 21 Oct 2008 at 9:55 pm #

    3ID, some things to consider:
    1. No more diesel. The refineries are going to shut down quick.
    2. No more ammo. The factories that make all that ammo will have shut down too. There is reloading equipment available (although hard to find) for the .50s
    3. No spare parts. These aren’t old GPs anymore. They break too often. Talk to your motorpool sgt and ask him how long his vehicles would last without a supply of spare parts.

    I’m not saying they are useless. They will have their uses, but they will be precious beyond belief. The higher ups that make it will keep them to protect their own butts and use the rest sparingly. People are (and will be even more so) cheaper. Think strategically and long term.

    “Zed’s dead baby, Zed’s dead.” – Butch

33. FallenKnight on 22 Oct 2008 at 11:27 am #

    Sorry I wasn’t clear about the safehouse Doc, I took it for granted that it would be well away from population. You do have some excellent observations & I’ll see if my .02 helps.
    I would also stay away from vehicles (sorry 3ID) unless you want to attract unwanted attention, and not just from the undead. Besides, the only thing that’s going to be left at your local NG Armory by the time you get there is space. And unless you’re a motor pool mechanic, stay away from any LAV, APC or similar vehicles, because their maintenance requirements exceed most people’s abilities. A school bus with a brush guard on the front should be fine, the windows are high enough to not worry about, you can lock the door shut and they are low-maintenance by design.
    3ID, the next time you go shopping look around. Is there a single stranger in the crowd that you could point to & say, “I want that person driving the Stryker I’ll be shooting from.” Because that’s how it’s going to be. And while your plan for taking back the cities is sufficiently over-the-top, the logistics involved just aren’t going to happen post-Z-day. It’s going to be small squads of 6-8 men going door-to-door, room by room, exactly like it’s been since 6/6/1945.
    Get out, get armed, get safe, get help & get busy.

34. 3ID on 22 Oct 2008 at 6:34 pm #

    Fullcircle wow you are a fucking retard do you know what 3ID is THIRD INFANTRY DIVISION you know rock of the marine well i guess you don’t since that post of yours the 3ID don’t use the stryker but the have them down hear because FT Stewart has the largest training and area FUCKING DUMB ASS

    DR Who yes the petrol and ammo are a big factor so are spare parts you make it as they would break in a hurry well if all you do for the Zombie war is roll on highways and roads and my be off road hear and there they will last quite a bit longer the lets say rolling hard through Iraq and the vehicles i would have carrying the supplies would also have spar parts of course and petrol

    FallenKnight you your self can drive a stryker quiet simple so with hands training you could be come quit professional with the vehicle

35. ZAC Admin on 22 Oct 2008 at 8:01 pm #

    Let’s keep it civil so I can avoid using the delete option.

36. JAKAL on 22 Oct 2008 at 8:54 pm #

    Good job guys keep thinking outside the box. 3ID I like your idea of the strykers, but lets think in terms of the outbreak happens while you are on leave or in some thirdworld shithole. You are better off in the shithole granted.I know been there done that got the t-shirt to prove it.

    If your at home shooting pool with your buddies you do have a pool stick and a billiard ball wrapped in a towel is pretty effective.

    I carry a gun even at work but I realize the gun is not the final solution. In an event of an out break I’m heading for a contruction site
    there is bound to be goodies there to make improvised weapons galore. I also no how to drive a couple of the vehicles that would be on site.
    Most sites are ringed by a nice sturdy fence that would hopefully buy me some time to think and plan on ways to survie order to get to my guns. Stay Safe

37. Dr Who on 22 Oct 2008 at 9:18 pm #

    Problem is the roads won’t be clear. Even if the outbreak starts full swing in the middle of the night, people will be fleeing homes and driving on the streets only to abandon vehicles in traffic. Cars and trucks will be having accidents left and right. Fires will be started by those fighting the dead and by those fleeing them. Debris will be everywhere both left there by accident and put there on purpose. And then you have the bodies. The intitial outbreak will be utter chaos and the cities and suburbs will show it. This will certainly cause lots of problems with transportation in the area. And in-city off roading is really harder on vehicles than the normal kind. Similar to off roading in extremely rocky conditions.

    I’m not saying that our military vehicles are fragile, just that the modern ones are maintenance heavy. That added to to fact of few civilians knowledgable enough to repair them will hamper use of them. And like I’ve said before, what spares you start with, is all you get before you have to start cannabalizing others. You’ll effectively be gambling your vehicles. You’ll have to have a Recovery Vehicle with you (a tank turned into a tow truck with a lift on it) if you lose a transmission or crack a drive shaft.

    The complexity of all this will compound the longer you use them. This with the fact that you will still be clearing buildings with personel. Going toe to rotting toe in urban warfare. And razing buildings (the ones that haven’t burnt down) isn’t the way to go. Remember, you’re there for supplies otherwise you’d use 155 howitzers and MLRSs (doubtful air support will be flying).

    I’m not saying the rolling thunder style of approach won’t be effective in certain situations. Long convoys and armies of corpses (like outside of the mall in Dawn) your approach is appropriate. But the further you get into the city with more scattered groups of zeds it loses it’s advantage. Why use your heavy weapons on a group of 20 considering that every 25mm API round you use is irreplacable.

    Everything has it’s place. From artillery to clubs, you’ll need them and use them. Plus alot of this equipment will be hard to get by the rest of us, coupled with most bases not making it through the outbreak. EVERYONE is going to be heading there with orders given from higher up that you protect american citizens. Some are going to coming running in bitten and who’s going to know that is what does the zombie trick to start with? Now you’re fighting deadies on BOTH sides of the fence. Sure some bases will make it, some aren’t. Not all the bases have the fun toys either, remember that. Or Infantry/Cavalry troops. I (and being in the army, I can say this) think most of the bases will fall and those that don’t are going to be rough and nasty. What do you do when Charlie company’s area and barracks are overrun? Call in fire. What about the motorpool, call it in. No one is going to think long term until it’s too late. Hard to think about next month when you’re fighting for your life today.

    “Zed’s dead baby, Zed’s dead.” – Butch

38. Dr Who on 22 Oct 2008 at 9:19 pm #

    Jeez, I’m long winded. Sorry about that everyone.

39. JAKAL on 23 Oct 2008 at 3:10 pm #

    Dr Who well done if a little long at least your thinking it through.

    Airborne!

    Light Infantry is what it will come down to. Start learning middle age tactics and weapons. Pretty soon it will be down to swords and spears and if your a real good engineer maybe a catapult. Might also want to get aquainted with sieges, field sanitation, basic first aid for every day cuts and sprains. I won’t go into bites or scratches from zed we all pretty much know the out come for that. Stay Safe

40. Dreamornaut on 24 Oct 2008 at 3:09 am #

    Yeah, I could see siege tactics playing a crucial role, which I mention my plans in ‘Where will you go when all hell breaks loose?’ using an old farmhouse. If I could have a good number of people I would work on eventualy replacing the ramparts with a stone and mortar walls with gun loops. Hehe, I’ve already planned on where I could get the materials for that.

    When it comes down to taking the fight to the dead, given enough numbers I could see something like a bait and lure technique to bring the zed against a tight formation of gunmen backed by pikemen behind a sturdy palisade. Though this is thinking in the very longterm if it comes down to, blackpowder muskets. I would hope to actually be doing better then this down the road, but might as well consider it. Either way smelting will likely make a comeback in a big way, or at least it will need to.

41. Dr Who on 24 Oct 2008 at 11:41 am #

    For the long haul, and that’s what we’re talking about here, remember a military term that has lasted since one city attacked another. Defence In Depth. Don’t rely on one wall, get two. Ten foot high with twenty feet in between, have easily removed airial walkways between the two. With this if one wall is breached You still have primary defence. Find alot of salt, rocksalt is perfect. To clear the surrounding area of vegetation to keep visibility high and your fields of fire open, spread the salt over the ground and wait for the first rain. This will quickly kill off all the surrounding vegitation and prevent it’s regrowth in the forseeable future. Just make sure you don’t plan on planting fields where you do this. With this setup, you could survive an allout assault from a legion of dead, with nothing but pre-firearm weaponry.

    “Zed’s dead baby, Zed’s dead.” – Butch

42. Fullcircle on 24 Oct 2008 at 5:52 pm #

    I stand corrected, 3ID. And no, I wasn’t familiar with the meaning of 3ID. Again, my fault.
    I’m so used to Lost Zombies where every other poster is a 12 year old claiming to be in the military, y’know?
    So yeah, My bad.
    No offense meant.

43. Dreamornaut on 24 Oct 2008 at 9:37 pm #

    Well when talking about this scenario, I think it’s important to also think beyond getting a few people to hide out in the wilderness for a few years. At some point when you have a secure defensible position, yes with multiple layers of defense, and a steady supply of food it will become important to aggressively procure technology. This means both new and old technology, and the means to make and maintain it when and how available. Including manuals, treaties, skilled labor, resources and having a method for educating the youth.

    As I said before I could definitely see smelting making a big comeback since there will be plenty of scrap available. Given a good number of people, and adicuate information information a old crank styled combustion engine that can run on bio diesel (it’s relatively easy to produce) could be produced, but just would need a new lubricant. Hydraulics, steam, solar heating, clock works, simple electronics, agricultural methods, medical techniques and practices as well as fabricating curtain medicines would still be possible at some level.

    Though a big part of any of this means having a good number of people, which would be best to have the core of early on. Though preparation on your, mine or him/hers behalf would be crucial to a larger groups survival. Basically talking about having enough long term food stores to last until settled as well as plenty of manuals on survival as well as rudimentary manuals on the applied sciences. On the plus side there has been an increase in interest for things relating to the fall of societies and appropriate reference material for rebuilding society is getting pretty common.

44. Dr Who on 24 Oct 2008 at 10:47 pm #

    The thing is if you’re talking really bad Class 4 outbreak, you need at least 10k people to breed without genetic drift. That’s inbreeding and other genetic problems that crop up when long lines of related people have intertwining family trees. And that is with keeping firm records of linage and pretty much telling people who they can and can’t have kids with. And you have to keep this up for a few generations.

    On another note, a walled community of about 200+ people is about minimum to sustain a decent town. That provides enough people to cover most of your important jobs, including a militia and dedicated scavenging teams. For quite a while scavenging will be the primary means of supplying town with supplies and raw material until the people have learned and had enough experience to make thier own products.

    This is what 99.9% of my plans and ideas are geared towards. Because otherwise what is the point of surviving and living till old age? I want to hear my grandkids ask “What were zombies like?”.

    “Zed’s dead baby, Zed’s dead.” – Butch

45. Dreamornaut on 25 Oct 2008 at 12:35 am #

    The best bet would be to have arranged marriages across a cluster of smaller communities. Setting up relations with other survivor communities would also be a requesite because of this, not to mention the benifits in trading to allow growth in this new society. In the long run, a coalition of such communities would evolve, though if such a society forms under a fuedal class system, despite what good it did in the middle-ages also has some setbacks to growth and has a tendancy for genetic drift within the ruling class due to favoring couplings for political gain.

    Talking about drift. Wasn’t this about improvised weapons? lol

46. Yamandù on 25 Oct 2008 at 6:17 am #

    Ok first of all, this thread is wonderful. I have long wondered how you could make it with out firearms in the case of a emergency like this. Thanks a lot, it’s been fascination to read this.

    I live in Europe and the only one that I know how have guns in the city’s are the police, the criminals and the army and there a lots of difficult problems with robbing them.

    I have been thinking a bit of this and my advise is that your best shoot in the beginning of a outbreak is to think light. You might want to bring the meanest, biggest club or multi tool you find but that will only make you slow and tired. You should focus on things that you can carry and use with out problems and that don’t bring you down in case of a chase. Something as a brass knuckle other light weight weapons.

    Hopefully fighting a zombie is more like fighting a drunk than a sober, skilled, street fighter.

    A few good hits, if your trained, will make it immobilised and you can make a run for it. This tactic is for staying on the run, focusing on avoiding more then killing.

    As a last note I think “hot sticks” or what they are called are a good stationary defend. You make spearheads of wood and bury them in ground and then the Z come they will get there legs pierced and they are easy prey for iron rod or similar. Ciao

47. Dreamornaut on 25 Oct 2008 at 8:32 am #

    In southeast asia I believe they are referred to as punjin, though I know there is a latin equivalent. Although zombies do not feel pain, they would be slowed down or even break something if set in a small hole like the romans did. Not a bad idea. Traps and snares might help out with base defense as well. This is assuming the zombie isn’t bright enough to figure out how to get free.

    The problem with getting close up is the likely hood that the part of the brain that keeps you from exerting enough force to break your own bones would likely not function in zombies. Although they may have the coordination of a blind drunken sailor with a severe concussion, once they get hold of you, you’re more or less meat.

48. Dr Who on 25 Oct 2008 at 1:34 pm #

    Yeah, this thread did kinda “drift” off topic. And yes a serious problem with fuedal systems is inbreeding in the ruling class. Contact with other surviving communities is almost a neccesity just for survival, though caution would have to be the word of the day. Read “Walking Dead” for good reasons why. While that is an extreme example, there will be the strong taking from the weak. After the intial period is over I really see the zombies as being more the equivalent of a force of nature, where the real threat will lie in other humans.

    As for light melee weapons, those are a severe liability. Fighting a zombie (Max Brooks or original dawn/day type) is more like fighting a blind, drunk, concussed, and stupid championship wieght lifter. They have none of the mental blocks we have, to stop us from tearing ourselves to pieces. They will have problems grabbing you, but once they do it is all over. While they don’t hit or kick and have next to no coordination, all they have to do is bite you once. Brass knuckles are COMPLETELY out ouf the question for a few reasons. For one the natural tendancy is to punck the head. With this you have a thing called “fight bite” (ask anyone working an ER) your knuckles get torn up from impact with the other persons teeth. It doesn’t matter if it bites you or you make it bite you, You are still bitten. Second, brass knuckles or lead filled “shot” gloves work by increasing the kinetic force of your punch. Maybe a championship boxer throwing his best roundhouse, wearing some big knuckles, on his BEST day MIGHT cave in a skull enough to kill a zed.

    Punji stakes, spike pits and the like would only really be useful in fixed defences slowing an attacking horde. Unlike the ones used against human enemies which are designed to wound, cripple, and infect (they would be smeared with dung) against zombies they need to slow and capture zombies. Dig deeper pits, with longer stakes, and preferably large barbs to prevent a zombie from pulling itself off quickly.

    “Zed’s dead baby, Zed’s dead.” – Butch

49. bern on 25 Oct 2008 at 11:21 pm #

    perhaps Polynesian or Indian war clubs would be a good substitute for the lack of a firearm. They were built to brain an enemy.

50. Goldfish on 26 Oct 2008 at 10:20 pm #

    Yeah, topic has drifted a bit… As for whoever it was that mentioned myself and Dr. Who putting alot of thought into this (too lazy to look it up >.>)) I can’t speak for Dr. Who but I know my focus has always been improvised melee weapons. The reason for this is the above mentioned general shoddiness of modern display weapons. Even weapons that are “combat ready” in your local shops are usually only going to have a half tang at best, rendering them useless in a combat situation after two or three swings. A wooden baseball bat would have more usefullness than that, simply because if it breaks in the right position you can still defend yourself. The other thing I’ve seen discussed several times are the use of vehicles, specifically from our resident gung ho Huah mofo 3ID. I would like to echo the sentiments of many here and remind everyone that, regardless of how much firepower you have in the bed of your pickup/hummer/tank/apc/ambulance, you still run into one major drawback: road reefs. There stands to reason that there would be people turning while behind the wheel, creating massive backups and traffic jams all around your nearest city. I live outside of Nashville in a medium sized city, and even with a lack of Zeds traffic is a freakin’ nightmare. Now, unless you already live in the sticks, when you pick up and go in your mobile murder machine you will perhaps make it forty yards before hitting the evacuation gridlock. Even if you’re lucky enough to make it out of your metropolis, you’ll hit stalled vehicles, wrecks, and other gridlocks all along the way. If you get a chance, pick up a copy of Stephen Kings The Stand and Cell, though not technically zombie stories they both show a great deal of thought put into traffic along evacuation routes. In The Stand (which I’m rereading now, hence my bringing it up ), there is even a case of people who had used tow trucks to create a blockade for the purpose of stopping the living and stripping them of gear and supplies, killing the men, and drugging up the women for the purpose of rape. That leads us to believe that the roads will not only be cluttered but potentially hazardous simply because without a system of law and order, the world will crumble to it’s basest, most violent level. Another Stephen King reference here, but in Cell it brings up the point of humanity reaching it’s place on the top of the food chain not because we are stronger, nor faster, nor even smarter than any animal. We got where we are because we, as a species, are completely insane. We have always been the most murderous motherf****** in the jungle. Keep that in mind, because on the freeways of this country there is alot of time for someone to see you, and figure out what they’ll do with you when you’re in an armor column…

    For all his bluster, it is the sad province of Man that he cannot choose his triumph. He can only choose how he will stand when the call of destiny comes.
    -Mohinder Suresh

51. Dreamornaut on 27 Oct 2008 at 1:56 am #

    Although I am not a expert, I’ve had the oppurtunity to get a good look at maybe a couple hundred swords of various styles over the years and I have to say that all but maybe four were pretty crappy craftsmanship. Three were genuine antiques and I’ve only scene one ‘battle ready’ sword that was even worth checking into. The others, most of which were odviously decrative regardless of advertising, were pretty poorly crafted.

52. 3ID on 27 Oct 2008 at 4:31 pm #

    Fullcircle no bad blood man, i hate those little snot nose kids think there all that because they know a couple of army words

    Goldfish DR Who and Dreamornaut knock en me and and my idea i look back and said HOLY SH*T i am a complete moron i am thinking to army and it scares me a little at this point my stand on IW is they will come in handy along with a good rifle i carry a tomahawk made by Emerson the cqc-t and a six inch knife but when i go out any were i look for IW especially in a hardware store that is just a haven for IW

53. Dreamornaut on 28 Oct 2008 at 2:07 am #

    There really isn’t anything wrong with that 3ID.

    Hehe, I know at one point in my life back in my teen years, our place had various improvised weapons everywhere. Under the couch was a old butcher knife and a hammer under one of the cushions. The door always had a baseball bat sitting next to it. There was always a 12″ socket extention rod next to the toilet behind the plunger. My ma had a clever under her pillow and I had a hatchet with a taped up handle sticking out between the matress and boxspring of mine. Next to my bedroom door I allways kept a 34″ heavy closet rod and a really large socket wrench on the right side of my desk.

    The good old days, hehe.

    I did use the closet rod a few times before it splintered, but I don’t think I would even try it against a zombie. The thing was just to light to cause more then pain and superficial injury. Used a small bat once when I worked at a gas station (long story) and it cracked after the second blow, but it was still usable for a couple more swings since we put a few layers of duct tape over it. Though I guess doing so technically makes it a weapon in the eyes of the law and although I didn’t get charged, I guess I could’ve been. After that someone just took a big claw hammer, pulled off the rubber handle and tapped it up, just so we could say we lost the handle if something like that happened again.

    Oh, which should be a consideration. Alot of all steel or alluminum shaft tools have rubber handles that tend to slide off or tear off when used as IW. If you have the time and a role of duct tape, replacing the rubber grip with tape makes for a way more stable grip on your choosen implament of emergency zombie brain surgery. The draw back being that it might be a little more slick when wet with certain viscous fluids. My biggest worry though is that if the zed doesn’t really use it’s frontal lobe and most of the zed’s brain functions come from the R Complex, simpley braining it might not be sufficiant.

    Hey, anyone know at what rate calcium decay might occur, that could be advantagious.

54. Goldfish on 28 Oct 2008 at 4:14 am #

    I’m not meaning to down you in any way 3ID, and as far as firepower is concerned I’d trust your judgment. However, as both a civilian and a cynic it is my civil duty to look down alternate avenues. People in the military will have to unlearn some things in the event of an outbreak, but are still one of the greatest assets a situation. And Dreamornaut brings up a magnificent point of the Zed’s brain use. I agree that the zombies will not, at all, use their frontal lobes, nor the speech center of the brain and various other parts. This, as I mentioned earlier, is why I tout blunt weapons over puncturing weapons. A katana with a laser sharpened edge and reinforced full tang that can cut through a phone book in one pass could, theoretically, lop off the entire portion of the forehead containing the frontal lobe and leave your zed wandering around mutilated. Think of what your blunt object is doing not so much as crushing certain parts of the brain (though that part is useful), but more as a device for creating concussions (I apologize for the alliterations, it’s 4 am). When the head is jarred the brain rattles around, crashing against the brain case and causing damage. By the time a zombie has reanimated most, if not all, of the fluid in the skull would have dried out, creating what is essentially a “skull maraca”. The brain will jostle around, getting damaged by impacting the skull more than the weapon, and kill the zombie. Without the cerebral fluid to absorb the shock, it’s alot easier for fatal concussions to happen.

    For all his bluster, it is the sad province of Man that he cannot choose his triumph. He can only choose how he will stand when the call of destiny comes.
    -Mohinder Suresh

55. Angryvikingman on 28 Oct 2008 at 6:01 pm #

    I like my 2 handed sword. Germans are brutally efficient when it comes to that kind of thing, so I trust their judgement. LOL.

    As for making a run for it out of the city…

    Think about car and truck lots. Or even construction equipment. I know two or 3 places to score a bulldozer. Grab a couple of vehicles and up armor them. Spend a few days clearing a route out of the city with your bulldozer, and then head out of town. Take a dump truck and put an old school steel cattle scraper on the front like old steam powered trains had and use that to clear the way down back roads to get where you’re going. Interstates and larger roads like that will be too congested with abandoned cars to push through, and are likely places for an ambush. (As mentioned above)

    If you have any kind of national guard station in your city, generally they’ll have a few good vehicles, and some .50 cals if you’re lucky.

    Put your roadblock buster in front, and arm it to the teeth. Then another security vehicle. Then passenger vehicle. Then security. Always have a security vehicle in the rear.

    Keep in mind that your roadblock buster is going be the first thing that an opposing faction is going to try and disable, and then cripple the rear car to trap you. Then all of the vehicles between are trapped. At least, that’s what I’d do.

56. Angryvikingman on 28 Oct 2008 at 6:09 pm #

    Also, learning how to spot a possible ambush is a must. If you see cars that have obviously been placed in the road, then its an ambush or some other type of barricade. Expiditionary vehicles and people searching the area on foot before you get there and keeping in contact via radio is a good idea. That way your convoy doesnt come under fire. Most people in rural areas arent going to be able to mount a high level of resistance. Especially to an armored convoy. Keep in mind that every pound of steel you add to a vehicle will also limit its operational range and fuel efficiency, so plan accordingly.

57. Goldfish on 28 Oct 2008 at 9:47 pm #

    I like Angryvikingman’s angle on the vehicle argument, but I think that would be something for post-escape. If you’re in stage 1 of a class 3 or 4 outbreak you want to be nowhere near the roads, simply because of the amount of people turning on the roads and the way people drive when they’re panicked. As for the later stages a convoy may be quite useful, because relocation will have to happen at some point, especially if you live in an urban environment. My solution to this is quite simple: city buses. Most cities have converted their buses to either electric or hybrid electric vehicles, making them unparalleled in use when the fecal matter hits the oscillating fan. Even without someone with the welding experience or mechanical know-how to attach a cow catcher or bulldozer or whatever to the front you have enough mass that is made to take an impact to shove things out of your way. Easily armored, high windows, fuel economy, what more could you ask for.

    My dream convoy would work like this, two city buses (all of this is assuming we can get all the supplies/vehicles), that are lightly armored with seats removed from the back half of one. In the back one you have two dirtbikes. These craft are quick, can power over rough terrain, and make outstanding scouting vehicles. Along that, assuming you have a good welder, one or two small sports vehicles with sun roofs. With little practice someone can stand out of the sun roof with a rifle and act as a turret man. Not Finally, an old fashioned boom arm and hook tow truck. With just one of these, if you’re going down back roads, you can quite easily move stalled vehicle out of the way. With the buses fully loaded and everyone on the same page, wherever you decide to land permanently becomes a city or small town. You have civilization. Granted, this is all speculation and with my luck I’d get my hands on an Escalade and a honda with a blown headgasket…

    For all his bluster, it is the sad province of Man that he cannot choose his triumph. He can only choose how he will stand when the call of destiny comes.
    -Mohinder Suresh

58. Angryvikingman on 29 Oct 2008 at 7:49 am #

    Yeah, I meant that whole thing to be post disaster. Like a week or so into it.

    My dream convoy would be a minimum of 4 vehicles. Assuming I had the man power, I’d have:

    Scout truck: Something light, fast and packs a punch with the mounted .50 Cal

    Gate Crasher: An earth mover of some sort. Most likely a dump truck. They’re adapted for a semi off road environment, and can plow through just about anything. AND you can turn it around on a 2 lane road if you have to. Equipped with a winch, it could act as a tow truck.

    Security Vehicles: Crew cab pickup trucks with 4 doors and mounted guns in the back. Preferably crewed by 6 people. 2 gunners and 4 armed passengers. These would also have a nice zombie killing bumper.

    Passenger vehicles: 12 or 15 passenger vans. In a pinch an 8 passenger mini van would do. The doors open on both sides, so it could make for a nice assault vehicle.

59. Scaryalbino on 30 Oct 2008 at 3:23 pm #

    i have played this what can i use for close combat in a pinch game. i can tell you right now in my dorm room i could probably whip some things together.

    lets start with the easy one, the mini fridge, i live on the third floor so i would think that i would hear screams long before i see walking dead. so i go to the stairs, hear the groaning of corpses ploding up the stairs, go back to my room pull the mini fridge or tv out of the wall and drop it down the stairs. so maybe it wont kill them but hey its going to at least break stuff on the way down and it clears the first landing.

    on to the second landing, how am i going to clear that? well one thing i do have is lysol spray and a lighter, can be deadly if you screw up but there is a low chance of that happening. i probably would not use this anyway as something about zombies is bad, zombies on fire is worse.

    i liked that surge protector idea but let me take it a step further i got two pillow cases and two thirty five pound weights, some of you are saying “they will rip right through those pillow cases.” nope ive doubled the cases up with one weight and smashed some plywood with it before. that second pillow case is made of some ex military stuff i swear all i know is its the least comfortable thing to sleep on.

    ok so what do i have, a flail that has some pretty good stopping power, a mini fridge hurling down the stairs as hard as i can throw it, one thing that probably no one has thought of is laundry detergent, once that fridge stops moving and ive gotten past the first wave of zombies, might as well open the bottle up and start running, slip and slide zombies might be childish but im thinking slippery substance tile floor, plus the fact that its still on the second floor. so zombies are now trying to keep ballance on a slippery incline. not going to happen.

    alright so i might have pulled that one out of my ass and saved my neck. thats why im saying im only on the second floor now, there is no way i could jump and be ok, its cement on both sides, plus if your reading this im assuming you dont want me to take an easy way out you want me to go all the way out of the building the way any normal person would. for fun lets say my hand weight pillow case rips open.

    next item in my room, well that hand weight is going to make for a shitty weapon now. just so you know im playing this one like i cant break any furniture in my room, hate to have to pay the damage deposit. and im not going to jip you guys by tearing the mine fridges door off.

    ok i didnt want to use this because its not always like this, i usualy keep a stainless steel bottle of frozen water in my fridge, its got a decent grip on it so i guess i could swing it pretty hard. that and my laundry hamper tossing it over ones head to slow them down a little (hey if it works on my room mate it has to work on zombies) one last thing i would say is i have a 2 inch by about four foot wooden dowel in my room, please just don’t ask its a trophy i won. i think between all of that i could make it to the ground floor.

    Ground floor, theres a bottle of whiskey in here too, hope it give me the blinding courage to get across the parking lot and to my truck where i have shovels, hoes, rakes, even a wood cutting ax.

    hope ya had fun

60. sofa+pizza=happy on 01 Nov 2008 at 10:01 am #

    The zombies have 1 advantage only, there are more of them. They are slow they don’t react emotionally, to anything. They are never scared of anythjing, which is one of the humans greatist allies, fear. This keeps us safe.

    Also the fact theres more of them is also a dissadvantage to them, think about it, you throw a chair at zombie, its probably going to miss, throw it at a bunch of close together zombies, it hits at least one of them 70% of the time.
    Because zombies are in big bunches, all you have to do is get there dry corse set on fire and in a few minutes, the lot are on fire. But how do you set them on fire you ask. simple, deodrant. If you’ve ever used it it says keep away from fire because obviously, it makes fire bigger. Simply set fire to a few sticks with your zombies clothes rags you nicked from next door wardrobe and using deodrant. throw them into the zombie horde. Then sit down with fellow survivers with the last packet of popcorn in town and watch the horrible likkle zombies burn.

    Zombies also have no idea how to drive (i hope not anyway), simply go down to the local supermarket, or watever, stick random things in the ignition in a lorrys ignition till it works and hey presto, youve got the perfect up close and personal zombie killin weapon. simply drive the lorry into the horde and maybe get a takaway and you’ve got the perfect friday night activities sorted out.

61. Angryvikingman on 01 Nov 2008 at 10:25 am #

    How would I keep my ass in the clear you ask? Give my roomie the shotgun, and take my AR-15, and a socket wrench and disconnect the bottom of my apartment stairs while he covered me. Then walk back up and disconnect the bolts at the top. There, problem solved unless zombies learn to super jump. Its like 12 feet to the landing. Nothing a piece of ply wood from the ceiling of one of the other apartments couldnt fix. Then just make sure the other tennants on the floor are not infected. Hopefully the power stays on for a few days, maybe even weeks, and the same with the water, but it will be getting triple filtered after boiling. Ignore spelling and stupidity, I’ve been drinking.

62. sofa+pizza=happy on 01 Nov 2008 at 5:03 pm #

    Those zombies are slow, so just trap one, execute it with a merchety, axe, nuckleduster, boxing glove with barbed wire attached, chair, urinal or watever and repeat.

63. Fullcircle on 03 Nov 2008 at 9:49 pm #

    Erm… not to sound skeptical, sofa+pizza, but what exactly would a boxing glove wrapped in barbedwire do? All the barbed wire would do is poke very small, holes in the zombie (not enough to reach the brain) and also poke very small, painful holes into your hands once it cut through the gloves (or at least ruin a perfectly good pair of boxing gloves.)

    And hey, what’s worse than a crazy bastard who doesn’t feel pain and wants to eat you? A crazy bastard who doesn’t feel pain, wants to eat you and is ON FIRE. Burning isn’t going to do anything to the brain for awhile, allowing that zombie to keep coming, setting your safehouse on fire and probably eating your face.

    Brass knuckles= last resort. Broken knuckles don’t help you any at all. Machete or axe would be decent, though.

    And you don’t throw the chair at the zombie. you whack it with it. and then whack it with the broken pieces of it. Throwing a chair (from a normal person, anyway) isn’t gonna contribute much towards brain decimation. And if you have good aim, you’ll hit a single zombie with a thrown chair probably something upwards of 90% of the time (not an exact figure, that). If you have a chair, you’re probably inside. If you’re inside, the zombie is probably less than 3 yards away. You probably won’t miss from that close. Unless it just bit your eye or something.

    That local supermarket you were talking about? It’s probably flooded with people either looking for supplies, looting or trying to eat the people in the first two groups. Have you ever seen wht hitting a deer does to a vehicle? I’m not expert on the subject, but I imagine that would have a similar effect on an unreinforced vehicle. I’m not quite sure what the exact definition of a lorry is, but I’m going to assume it’s something similar to a semi. That might work, but good luck finding one that several other people aren’t trying to steal as well.

64. Luciano on 04 Nov 2008 at 5:53 pm #

    men… i think i am lucky /not for be fu****g armed / because i live in argentina in a small town in the state of Santa Fe away from all the big cities and… i dont think that here theres some kind of secret laboratory for the re animation *cure* ..or virus but the point is how much time a human /infected/ can came here mabe in that time we ..or i can ..i dont now make some barricades buy some guns , ammo, food …whatever if theres a zombie outbreak and alll are died unless you the food in markets will not dure all your life and ….see the documental of history channel ”world after people” or something like that ; it will explain the rest of my point. KEEP ALIVE….YEH..IF YOU CAN.

65. 3ID on 05 Nov 2008 at 2:30 pm #

    Luciano wow you about as bad at grammer as i am buts its all good right when the worlds go who will need grammer not this guy i have my FAL,AR15

66. 3ID on 05 Nov 2008 at 2:31 pm #

    About punching a zombie not such a good idea frist any of its blood gets on your hand and in to a little cut your SOL so i would always were gloves coming from the army its is a good invest ment get the ones with carbon fiber knuckles they last a lot longer like Okly or Wily-X 60 to 80 $$$ but trust me it is worth the cash and if a zombie dose get in your bubble isolate its moth area and then elimanate the head for me the best IW weapon would be one with reach like a broom or a shovel some type of spear but that is just a last ditch effort so i can get to my Rifles

67. sofa+pizza=happy on 05 Nov 2008 at 3:11 pm #

    thanks mate, safe!

68. Angryvikingman on 06 Nov 2008 at 11:34 am #

    I used to have a FAL. A DSA STG 58 actually. Pretty good gun. The flimsy stamped metal top plate bent around the ejection port though. So I got a nice milled top cover from tapco. Needed a scope mount for it anyway. I wish I would have gotten a FAL para congo. A nice aimpoint or ACOG and it would have been perfect. I love the .308 round. Had an HK SR9TC too. Mmmmm… germans make the best guns. I would love to have an HK 416 upper for my AR-15 lower. Stupid gas blowback operating systems suck. The germans figured that out after the 2nd world war. America has yet to figure that one out. But I digress. I still think we need to do an article on improvised explosives. I dont care what anyone says… Explosions are fun. Too bad that you need to have a Class 3 destructive device FFL to make things that go boom… *tear* One day I’ll find somewhere to legally acquire some freaking grenades. I’m going to put together a gear article and post it on the MZPK page….

69. The Snake on 12 Nov 2008 at 6:20 pm #

    Ok, Im a American so keep that in mind.

    1. A blunt weapon covered in nails? ??? no good, keep in mind, while it may be money the first strike, getting it out of the skull will be a pain.

    2. Polearms. They work well on the living because they respond to pain, however the undead, unless you have a cross hilt to keep them from pushing through to you is pretty useless unless you set up a kill holdin your door way to drive them back.

    3. Guns, I recommend a pump shotgun sawed off handle and barrel with 00 buck shot gun shells.

    4. 9mm is old school round, recommend a .40 cal, get around the same shots with more stopping power. Glock is good because its less likely to jam.

    5. Rifle, semi auto 556 mm. You can carry more ammo.

    6 Ammo. Realistically 5.7 mm would be perfect due to amount of ammo you can carry, with very lil kick. Expensive tho.

    7. swords……… machete would be better, than a katana.

    8. Location. Find a location, where there are stairs leading up to your home base. Layer the stairs with trip wires every few steps so you can trip up zombies. Roof access is a must.

    Standard equipement. Water/ food/ flares/ rope/ handcuffs/ gasoline/ radio/ nighvision goggles/ flashlights/ blankets/ bandages/ axe/ and last but not least a sign on your house that says “Survivors inside!!!.”

70. Angryvikingman on 13 Nov 2008 at 8:28 am #

    Why the hell would you want to saw off the stock of a 12 guage? Put a folding stock with pistol grip on it. Trip wires on your stairs? Not a good idea. Block off the stairs and use a ladder. Harder to get up, but easier to defend. As for the survivor sign, that’s a good idea, but I have one addition. Make some way to indicate the date that you are still alive. Like “Survivors Inside: 11-13-08″ and make a way to change the date on a daily basis. That way people know you’re alive on that day, not however long ago the whole thing started.

71. OfficeWorkerNotZombieBait on 13 Nov 2008 at 1:51 pm #

    Maybe I’m just over simplifying, but many items could be used in a zed scenario at my office.

    A length of network cable wrapped around the neck of said living challenged with a latch to a coat hook or door jam until a pummeling item could be found such as that chair, laptop, or file drawer should work.

    Several different cleaning sprays could be improvised as mini flame throwers.

    The small step stool next to the archives could be a shield or pummeling weapon if need be.

    Luring one through an empty computer rack could create an excellent cage to hold for later disposal.

    Not sure how they hold up to shock but a stripped power cord to a metal door frame would be worth trying.

    Empty boxes and Styrofoam wouldn’t be better than a momentary distraction but might buy enough time grab something better or close a door and barricade them out.

    Now as I walk through the halls everyday items take on new shapes. The garbage can, the time clock, the planter, and the front lobby lamp could all be useful at the right moment.

72. 3ID on 13 Nov 2008 at 6:41 pm #

    Angryvikingman i like the sign idea with changing dates i never thought about it that way but for me i would never want to stay cooped up in a small place any how i would find a nice spot and plan on living there with a couple of other survivors i would not want to attract the wrong people IE bandits or scum in general

73. Angryvikingman on 16 Nov 2008 at 11:43 am #

    You could always put the sign on a building near you and set up an observation post. That way you could determine the intent of arriving groups.

74. 3ID on 16 Nov 2008 at 7:38 pm #

    true but getting to the other building might be a little difficult not sure what a Class 3-4 out break would look like i am just thinking dawn of the dead type you know were the building is surrounded but if bandits and IE scum show up you can always solve it with a little bit of copper coated lead

75. jacob on 21 Nov 2008 at 7:59 pm #

    a firearm to most people in that situation would be there primary thought to find one but those who would rely on it soley wouldnt last long if you can get to a gun but not safely find yourself a weapon or some way to get to one but yes if you know where to look you can find a gun do what you can to take down a zombie that is a threat to you but if i had to choose between snapping the neck of one or trying to pop in another clip id snap the neck when faced with the undead take the quickest choice to taking one out

76. Angryvikingman on 24 Nov 2008 at 10:49 am #

    If you are familiar with your gun and gear, then you don’t have to look to replace a clip, and a quick smash to the head with the butt of the gun will buy you time to reload, or turn to run.

77. jordan on 25 Nov 2008 at 8:23 pm #

    Does any body else hate having to read through all the comments to make sure no one has brought up your genius idea already or is it just me?

    I live in america, i live in a small town, i work in agriculture, i got guns, but the’re still not always within reach. If youve got a job where you can carry a gun all day and its more than a desk job wtf are you doing? My beater rifle is an cheap little sks (and i do mean little the original chinese stock feels like a youth model) It rides in my truck and i got plent of surp ammo. wow what a suprise another guy who says hes allways got a gun, no i dont.

    In fact i rarely carry a pocket knife. You know why? Cause i work in a damn machine shop! Im surrounded by heavy pipes, tools, really fucking sharp things, and since were excluding fire arms i wont count the ones lying around there. OMG if anyone from OSHA sall that place.

    When im out and about the truck even stays at the shop i dont like ridin around in the tractor with a gun just in case fish n game comes around, this brings me to my next point. Almost every one over sixteen is within a hundred yards of one of the most commonly used devices cappable of destroying a human body. the motor vehicle.

    Like administration posted as the num. one thing to consider use your brain. You tell me what takes the least amount of effort: pushing down gently with your right foot and doubling over a zombie’s body with your bumper smashing its skull against the hood of your car, sedan, pick-up, what ever OR ripping the leg off the computer desk and hoping to god the next thirty blows with the sad little peice of alluminum tubing will be the one to kill the fucker makin all that damn moaning?

    Id love to see what the 70320 john deere i drive on almost a daily basis would do to a zombie especially with the loading spears for bails on front, but most of all i want to see zed bodies being puraide into smothie furtilizer as the 20′ batwing bush hog i tow behind opens up a can of 25,000 RPM whoop-ass on em. let the stump jumpers ride, let em ride, let em ride, let em ride!

    Even in an office setting which i assume a majority of people do, theres tools lying around in a nearby maintenece closet. Come on at least a hammers better than a key board (insert zombie panic plug here) Does any one else have a sick dream of killing zombies in an interesting way, perhaps involving a computer monitor? Not the new kind though, im talkin old school, big as a tv, like everyone really has cause the boss is to cheap to spring for flat screens. rip it from the cpu and chuck that mother-fucker or at least bean (yes i said bean as in to hit) one in the head, hell yeah!

78. Michael J on 02 Dec 2008 at 3:10 am #

    I have one word for the best weapon to use and that is a katana or Naginata, use those right and you have weapons that can take down zombies easily. And in the case of firearms, its never a bad idea to buy a gun and have it on you just in case you come across a few zombies. Remember to stick to .45 caliber or so….and avoid the shotguns if at all possible, use rifles in their stead. A M-16/M-4 have great stopping power, AK-47′s are awesome, and look into some odl school stuff like M-14′s or so….and try not to use bolt action rifles, and if you are lucky enough find the .50 caliber machine guns and stuff like that from armories, you can break into them….just have to use your imagination.

79. 3ID on 04 Dec 2008 at 4:15 pm #

    i would never use a machine gun on Zeds waste of ammo other people yes its a great but for Zeds AR FAL M14 are the three biggies AK is great but past 200 yards your SOL 308/223 are your best bet plenty of ammo available in are arms room we have a pallet of 223 and god knows how many M4 to go with that ammo

80. Tyrannysaurus Bex on 07 Dec 2008 at 8:47 pm #

    Hey guys, uhm little question here. Isn’t the point of this whole post to come up with creative ways to kill a zed WITHOUT a gun? really. really people. come on, we need to start thinking outside the box and come up with stuff other than… Guns (which are kinda null for this post) and the 60 something people with katana’s on hand.
    really?
    i mean really?

    I mean all power to you all if you actually have a katana and such, but they look like they would shatter, and I’ve kinda seen them take a hit, and split.

    What about using the smallest most annoying kid in the class as a weapon?
    seriously, snotty smart-pants Bernard won’t shut up about his superior intellect, what about his superior zombie smashing abilities.
    grab the sucker by his high-tops and swing him till he breaks.

    Think about it, one less mouth to feed, well… Human mouth that is.

81. Angryvikingman on 16 Dec 2008 at 10:23 pm #

    Katana…

    Gag me with a wooden spoon….

    Nuff said….

82. Sharpshooter on 06 Jan 2009 at 6:43 pm #

    i always have a machette in my MZPK so atleast for that im set…. due to martial arts training and my practical upbringing i should be alright if they come in small numbers but without my rifle im basicaly useless…. although if we find an easily defendable location will always volunteer for guard duity :D so those of you in the colorado area hit me up and we can make some plans and easy escape routs or meet up points

83. scaryalbino on 21 Jan 2009 at 3:10 pm #

    umm… martial arts… thats completly useless. your black belt is going to be used as a zeds napkin after you try to karatie chop one and it bites your hand off. smart move.

84. Zjechy on 22 Jan 2009 at 4:15 pm #

    i agree with scaryalbino.-hiya! oh no,not my leg!!-but if your like me,you can easily walk into the kitchen and have a wide variety of butcher knifes to choose from.also,steak knifes can be turned into throwing knifes.and,if you can reach them,fan blades will work.also i can go to our shed out back and grab a powerful sledgehammer or crobar.and if you’re brave enough, soak the zombie with water,then whip it with an extension cord.ZAP!! yes,when you stop and look,weapons are all around you.

85. Angryvikingman on 08 Feb 2009 at 2:11 am #

    Actually, martial arts are a practical weapon for zombie defense. A hard heel kick into the abdomen, then straight down onto the inside of their knee and that zed isnt going to be walking anywhere. If you have a blade(Sword, machete, ect.) then quick work can be made of the head if they’re bent over or on the ground. IF you are unarmed, you can always use a throw, or kick to slow them down enough to get away. Of course you’d want to avoid punching due to the fact that you could tear the skin on your hand and have blood on blood contact with the infected, thus infecting yourself. Also, this would only work with small numbers of the undead, 3 at the most.

86. Sharpshooter on 10 Feb 2009 at 2:58 pm #

    thank you Angeryvikingman. it may not kill them but it will sure as hell slow em down and give ME enough time to run like a bat out of hell.

87. PandemicAttack on 20 May 2009 at 8:36 pm #

    I looked around my room and actually found a lot of stuff. My favorite that I found is my computer charger. It has a long cord and a heavy adapter in the middle that looks like it could cause some damage. My other choices could be my laptop. I have a metal slingshot that I’m good with but I don’t know what force that throws stuff. Lol. I have a lamp i could use and a hanger rod in my closet. I was also thinking that wastebaskets could be forced over the zombies head to confuse him/her/it and then dispatch him/her/it. Not a good idea with hordes of them though. I have a wooden chair that I think would be great fun to smash over a revenant’s head. I also have this empty gigantic 6 gallon glass bottle of Canadian whiskey that I used to put money in. It would be great to smash over a zombies head and then used as a slashing weapon.

88. Zjechy on 16 Jun 2009 at 2:58 pm #

    i also think a fire extinguisher or a shovel would cause some damage. but i’m weird, i have a heavy iron padlock on a chain. i bet i could swing that around and cause injuries

89. Zjechy on 16 Jun 2009 at 3:01 pm #

    people make fun of me because i think zombies are real…

90. AlStar on 27 Jul 2009 at 1:52 am #

    I know anyone of us don’t want to be close to a zombie or a group of them, since they’re not dangerous at range. That makes the guns the weapon of choice for the first assault.

    But the guns need ammo and ammo its heavy. And most of the guns suggested are heavy too. Good on far and medium range, awful on close combat. With little or no time to aim and less to reload eventually all of us will need to use the old hitting and cutting weapons, specially after some weeks of stand.

    Cutting weapons, since they don’t need to be reloaded and doesn’t depends on ammo available. Even in case not fully taking down a zombie it could easily mutilate it, makin’ it unable to grab, or walk.

    My suggestion it’s to have at least one or two close ranged defenders ready in case of massive attack. That will buy time enough to reload, run or detonate something.

    Personally I like a pair of Machetes (about 2 feet long) since the machetes are easy to get, light to carry and use, needing little effort to harm, fast and sharp, since their made of a thin good steel.
    Besides, with some practice and in extreme needing, can be thown to gain extra time, and practically doesn’t need maintenance.

    A well oiled rustless machete will cut like butter, but it still works being rusty and old. That’s a lot more than any gun can do.

    And I agree, if you depend on the weapon, you’re cattle. Anything can be thrown or swung to cause massive damage (I mean, brain damage), even a zombie part can do the trick, at least to gain some time to run. ;)

91. 3-15 INF on 06 Aug 2009 at 8:22 am #

    Hey 3ID, what battalion are you in? I’m in the 1-30th INF now (used to be 3-15 Inf) I might know you.

    Anyway, I gotta agree with the comment about bringing it back to the middle ages. Even though I like my firearms, the post says what if you didn’t have ‘em. That’s why I’ve always considered my Cold Steel tomahawk as an additional side arm, and my Cold Steel hunting spear as a non- firearm primary. Gives slight range, can also be thrown, is durable, and can easily pierce a scull with a solid thrust to the face. I would attempt to construct a good shield too, maybe something from a car door. The ancient Romans and Greeks had it pretty right on. For an improvised weapon, go for the heaviest duty knife you have, remove the handle, split the end of a mop handle or garden tool handle (something long) and duct tape the blade to the end in between the split. Also, look up the Roman pillum- the sesign is pretty simple and is light, easy to carry several and can be thrown as well as used to jab with.

    ROCK OF THE MARNE!

92. Zjechy on 06 Oct 2009 at 2:37 pm #

    What does anyone think about hedgeclippers? The ones with the long blades, I mean. I’m not sure if those are strong or sharp enough to cut off the head of a zombie.

93. Hellspawn on 16 Oct 2009 at 11:51 pm #

    I think this is a great post, and most certainly needs to be addressed. Ammo is going to run out, if the outbreak lasts long enough. And not everyone will have the luck of finding a firearm, and chances are that you are going to run into a hungry rot before you can find one that is practical.
    Its never happened before, so all we can do is speculate that the zeds will rot, but there is on guarantee that they will. Therefore, it would be prudent to make sure that you have a weapon that does not need to be reloaded, and is easy to maintain and practical for everyday use. A good machete is a great tool, not just for killing zeds but for a wide range of needs. Easy to swing indoors, keeps an edge fairly well. I have a tool called a bushaxe, and trust me that is the first thing I am grabbing if the world goes to hell. Essentially, its a blade on a heavy duty shaft. long enough to keep attackers at arms reach, plus that long shaft gives you greatly increased swinging power. Short enough that it can be swung indoors without a problem, and the blade on most of them is usually very very sturdy, and keeps an edge very well. Other than that, Im bringing the machete, an all around tried and true zed killing tool. I have a pair of Kamas, but those would be my last resort, since they have a short reach and are ill suited for one-hit kills. But, in a pinch, they can be effectively used to incapacitate and kill a small group of zeds, and they are light and easy to take care of.
    and if all else fails, a baseball bat can be a very effective weapon. Light enough so swing quickly, but also hard enough to crack a zed skull. I would personally skip the nails, unless you are burying them into the wood up to the head, to create a sort of metal studding on the end. But the nails sticking out? too much risk that you get them stuck in a zeds head and get bit by another trying to pull it out. A plain old baseball bat will do just fine, since the object is not to cause pain, it is to bash the crap out of their heads.

94. Hellspawn on 16 Oct 2009 at 11:57 pm #

    @Zjechy:

    hedge clippers could be taken apart, at the bolt in the middle, to create something similar to two small swords. Ive done it to an old pair, if you sharpen up the blades they will do pretty well. As for using them assembled, you would need to get a large pair, some of the larger ones even have a mechanism that assists in snapping them shut, for large branches and such. applied to the neck , these might be useful, but a bit impractical if surrounded or fighting off a large group. also, it would be a one shot thing – you have to get really close to use them, and on top of that you would be extending bite-able bodyparts towards the zed. If you somehow happened to miss (unlikely, but wouldn’t it suck to die because of a fluke? ), the zed would be in very close range, and might be able to chomp you before you can recover.

95. Zjechy on 26 Oct 2009 at 5:04 pm #

    Never thought of that…thanks, you just saved my life. Now, i wonder about boomerangs. The real ones, that were used for war. I bet a good throw might be enough to take off a zed head, give or take a few, depending on theirs and your position.

96. leveller1 on 30 Nov 2009 at 9:36 am #

    i agree with die_angel. i live in england where not even the police go on patrol with a firearm. the best handgun i know is legal is a CO2 airgun version of a berreta pistol. the only firearm i own is a single shot air pistol that takes a while to reload. so i think that i wouldnt even bother shooting a PELLET from it. the best weapon i could get my hands on right now would be the chair i am sitting on, or the table, i could use one of the legs of the table to give a zombie a good whaking! if i had quicker acces to my shed then i would get a golf club out or something… Oh, and a bushcutter, it is portable, runs on petrol, and has a lethal spinning blade at the end of it. perfect for decapitation!

97. leveller1 on 30 Nov 2009 at 2:02 pm #

    CROSSBOW!

98. leveller1 on 30 Nov 2009 at 2:05 pm #

    i know i keep posting random comments, but i think that a boomerang would take a zombies head clean off

99. 3-15 INF on 14 Dec 2009 at 11:56 am #

    um, how would that work? A boomerang, even if it was made from metal sharpened like a sword and striking right on the neck would not cut a head off. It would bounce off. There’s a reason why weapons like that were never used widely in any combat. The spear on the other hand, in some form or another, was the most long used pre firearm weapon to be used as a primary arm. The sword was considered more as a sidearm, like a pistol. Always look at the past trends.

100. Angryvikingman on 14 Dec 2009 at 2:28 pm #

     If I’m not mistaken, a boomerang was for hitting small game/birds. Whereas they carried spears, and sometimes used an atlatl(spelling) for throwing the spear harder/farther.

101. 3-15 INF on 14 Dec 2009 at 6:24 pm #

     EXACTLY! boomarangs as far as I know have never been used for fighting

102. big bear29 on 30 Jan 2011 at 2:25 am #

     I find this topic to be kind of funny . The last time I checked there was supposedly a gun in one house out of every six , in texas its supposed to be one out of every three . Yet I have never been in a house in texas that didn’t have at least one gun in it and many had enough guns to take out a small town . When you go into a store around here you will see more than a few trucks with gun racks in the parking lot and many carry guns concealed in other places in their vehicle . In texas finding a gun is actually pretty easy , its harder to not find a gun in texas , their all over the place .

103. Angryvikingman on 30 Jan 2011 at 3:05 am #

     Where I live I know for a fact that all of my adjacent neighbors have guns, and they know that I have guns and ammo. They’ve all said when SHTF they’re coming here to party up. Not only that, most of my gun nut pals that live locally have agreed to my house as a rally place should SHTF. When I run out of ammo, (god forbid) I have enough swords and matchetes for at least 10 people, so I think I’ll be ok.

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